Egypt's Rubbish People

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CocoaButter
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Egypt's Rubbish People

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Unreported World exposes a dark side to Egypt that the authorities don't want foreigners to see: a secretive society of around 40,000 people literally living in rubbish in a Cairo ghetto overrun by rats and disease.

Unreported World exposes a dark side to Egypt that the authorities don't want foreigners to see: a secretive society of around 40,000 people literally living in rubbish in a Cairo ghetto overrun by rats and disease.

Reporter Evan Williams and producer James Brabazon are some of the first journalists to film inside the ghetto where tens of thousands live with garbage stacked to the roofs of their multi-storey homes - eking out a living recycling the rubbish by hand. It's a sight rarely seen by outsiders, and almost definitely not by the million British Tourists who visit Egypt every year.

This group is unique for another reason. They're part of Muslim Egypt's Christian minority; a community claiming to be besieged by persecution, extremism and a creeping Islamisation in Egypt's security services.
The Unreported World team highlights one the most sensitive issues faced by some of those in Egypt - their decision to convert to Christianity - a decision that some Muslims believe should be punishable by death under a strict interpretation of sharia religious law.

One convert, "Christine", tearfully claims that officers from the government's State Security Intelligence have threatened to torture those trying to convert, rape their daughters in front of them and jail them on false charges of prostitution.

"We are abused in the street, spat at, cigarettes are thrown at us, my young daughter who is eleven is hit by the teacher and told to wear the veil and taken to the Mosque to pray even though she doesn't know anything about the Islamic faith," she tells Williams.

Another Christian family tells the team that their 17-year-old daughter has been missing for five months. They believe she has been kidnapped and forced to marry a Muslim, yet claim that the police refuse to search for her because she is a Christian. The girl's father, Atef, claims that the police arrested him for two days and held him on a roof for six hours, handcuffed, in an effort to get him to stop looking for his daughter.

The team arranges a meeting with Gasser Abdul-Razak, of the Human Rights Watch group. He claims that for the last three or four years government officials have been illegally refusing to allow thousands of converts to register their new religion on their ID cards, a document vital for everyday life in Egypt.

Back at the Christian garbage collector's ghetto, Father Samaan, the chief Christian priest, tells Unreported World that Egyptian laws make it difficult to build new churches. Instead he had to excavate his church from the sheer rock of a mountain.

"If you can build a Mosque - which you can in Egypt - you should be able to build a church and you can't get that permission," he says. "That's not right. You should not be treated as Muslims Christians you should just be treated as citizens of Egypt."

I have seen this and yep it does sadden me plenty i been all over the world and seen many things but when it becomes your country it becomes a part of you .
:( Its so sad when religion divides .


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Claire
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Inaccurate

Post by Claire »

Yes this area where the rubbish collectors live is all Christian but they are NOT converts, nor is it a hidden secret place, anyone can go there. These Copts are part of a 2000 year old community of Christians in Egypt. There are some people who convert from Islam to Christianity but this is another issue.
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Re: Inaccurate

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Claire wrote:Yes this area where the rubbish collectors live is all Christian but they are NOT converts, nor is it a hidden secret place, anyone can go there. These Copts are part of a 2000 year old community of Christians in Egypt. There are some people who convert from Islam to Christianity but this is another issue.
yes i have seen it .
And i see there is high converting from Islam as well to Christianity .
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Re: Egypt's Rubbish People

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CocoaButter wrote: I have seen this and yep it does sadden me plenty i been all over the world and seen many things but when it becomes your country it becomes a part of you ..
I know that there is a big difference between the rich and the poor in Egypt as there is in many countries. But this is absolutely horrible that people have to live like this. This is so so so sad........
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What I'm saying

Post by Claire »

Cocoabutter what I'm saying is that the people who live here are NOT converts. Yes there are some people who convert but it is not the people who sort the rubbish.
Undutchable yes you are right it is sad that people live in these conditions but some people actually prefer to live in this community among Christians instead of in other areas where they might have problems with their neighbours. I have visited this area several times and despite the living conditions there is a strong sense of community here. There are also several Church and charity projects in this area helping to improve education and conditions there. But as you might know from other posts this community have also been affected by the recent slaughter of their pigs and changes in rubbish collection methods.
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What I'm saying

Post by Claire »

Cocoabutter what I'm saying is that the people who live here are NOT converts. Yes there are some people who convert but it is not the people who sort the rubbish.
Undutchable yes you are right it is sad that people live in these conditions but some people actually prefer to live in this community among Christians instead of in other areas where they might have problems with their neighbours. I have visited this area several times and despite the living conditions there is a strong sense of community here. There are also several Church and charity projects in this area helping to improve education and conditions there. But as you might know from other posts this community have also been affected by the recent slaughter of their pigs and changes in rubbish collection methods.
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Post by Hurghadapat »

The Christians were in egypt before the muslims so in a way it is their country.I also have seen this area of cairo along also with many other areas that most europeans would not want to live in but think they are far happier living there where they are among their own kind also don't think that most egyptians put the same emphasis on having to live in a nice house in nice area as we do,they are happier living close to relatives and life long friends. :)
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Post by Christine »

Also i get a feeling that ,maybe some "lost in translaton" may have happened in this report, because it would also be evry unusual for a christian girl to be forced into marrage with a muslim man.
The muslim family would much prefer that the boy marry into his own culture.
This not so secret society have lived by these means for generations, and as i think claire said have been hard hit since the culling.
I too have visited this area of cairo but didnt feel pity as i thought to the Zabaleen its a way of life, its what they know and what they are good at.
Even more problems could be in store for these people if the government bring in outside labor to clear the rubbish.
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Post by CocoaButter »

Christine wrote:Also i get a feeling that ,maybe some "lost in translaton" may have happened in this report, because it would also be evry unusual for a christian girl to be forced into marrage with a muslim man.
The muslim family would much prefer that the boy marry into his own culture.
This not so secret society have lived by these means for generations, and as i think claire said have been hard hit since the culling.
I too have visited this area of cairo but didnt feel pity as i thought to the Zabaleen its a way of life, its what they know and what they are good at.
Even more problems could be in store for these people if the government bring in outside labor to clear the rubbish.
Yes i agree but its not uncommon for a woman or a girl to be forced into another faith .It does happen .
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Post by Christine »

Im aware of that honey but its the less likely explanation for why this girl dissapeared, lets face it the Muslims and the Christians will take any small advantage to blame each other for any wrong doing.
The resentment on both sides culturally speaking runs very high, so if the girl has in fact dissapeared and they cant find a reason for it they are quite likely to blame outside influences, what ever they may be, and in this case theyve blamed the Muslms, but they cant prove it, so we dont know for sure do we, its all speculation, as is often the case in Egypt.
It just dosent help an already emotive couple of subjects when speculation is put into priint,how can it, when tensions already run high between the 2 cultures.
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Post by CocoaButter »

Christine wrote:Im aware of that honey but its the less likely explanation for why this girl dissapeared, lets face it the Muslims and the Christians will take any small advantage to blame each other for any wrong doing.
The resentment on both sides culturally speaking runs very high, so if the girl has in fact dissapeared and they cant find a reason for it they are quite likely to blame outside influences, what ever they may be, and in this case theyve blamed the Muslms, but they cant prove it, so we dont know for sure do we, its all speculation, as is often the case in Egypt.
It just dosent help an already emotive couple of subjects when speculation is put into priint,how can it, when tensions already run high between the 2 cultures.
Yes agreed whole heartly .
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Post by Christine »

We all know dont we hon that either side of the cultural divide will and do milk any bad situation for all its worth, its such a shame, as coptic christianity does bear a resemblance to islam in some respects anyway.
Why can they not learn to live in peace :)
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Sensitive issue

Post by Claire »

There are issues with Coptic girls getting involved with Muslims and then converting. I don't really want to start a big discussion here but this issue is discussed quite a bit within the Coptic community and there have been several examples of girls disappearing and then their families being told they have converted and got married (without the parents knowing). Who really knows what the motives for this are, maybe the girls fall in love but in other cases there are rumours of force and imprisonment. It is very difficult for the Coptic families when this happens. Their faith is their life, their identity, their hope so if a girl leaves the faith is is very hard for them to accept.
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Post by Christine »

I stand corrected Claire, and i can believe that it must be awful for those families, most of my friends are christian, so i know what you are saying in that thier belief is very strong.
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It's a nightmare

Post by Claire »

Don't want to offend anyone but to be honest this kind of scenario is a Coptic families worst nightmare. They have lost their daughter but she has also turned her back on her faith and all that this entails.
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